Question on carbide dies

Discussion in 'Ammo & Reloading' started by Tommycourt, Jun 9, 2015.

  1. Tommycourt

    Tommycourt Tommycourt

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    My carbide dies for my .45 are getting old, real old. The resizing die brings almost all of the casings within the proper size however once in a while one may slip through. My bullet seater is getting harder to control in making sure I get the right length. Some times it will have a .004-.005 difference. Most of the time it varies .003. I have taken them apart and cleaned them with brake cleaner and blown them out with my compressor. I am using an old Herters single stage reloader. Prior to resizing the casing I oil them with oil from Dillons Precision, which they recommend and I just mist them. Can carbide dies wear out and loose their precision or am I ok with them the way they all. Any suggestions or help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
    Tommy
     
  2. phideaux

    phideaux Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter

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    I guess I aint much help,

    but I use Lee carbide dies for my .45, and I take em apart and clean them about every 1000 rounds.

    But, I have never lubed the cases before sizing , using carbide.
    I have not had that problem of holding seating depth ,
    Mine may vary .002 , thats it. Most time they are same.

    Not familiar with the Herters, but is it possible your die is not locked in nice and tight?

    I use my old RCBS rock chucker., which is very strong and built like a tank, and keep the ram clean and lubed.

    Jim
     

  3. Tommycourt

    Tommycourt Tommycourt

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    Jim,
    I have the loader clamped down on my bench with 2 BIG C clamps so there is no movement. Yes the loader is old but when Herters built something, they weren't known for making anything light. I bet it weighs close to 35lbs. As far as lubing the casings, Dillon came out with that last year and the other day I went over to Sportsman's (day I saw the gun you wanted) and they also sell casing lubricant. After tumbling your casings, the also say to "mist" your shells before resizing. I guess this is just something that we never did years ago to pistol, but we always lubed rifle casings. I guess at this point I really don't know. Hope someone can answer the carbide question.
    Tommy
     
  4. phideaux

    phideaux Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Yeah I always lubed rifle cases ,because my rifle dies are not crabide.
    I was told years ago NOT to lube cases when using carbide, that its not needed, and just causes the dies to get gunky .

    I dunno , cause Ive never lubed the ones for carbide.

    I do know(man do I know) if you dont lube the case for non-carbide you gonna get stuck..:rolleyes:

    I was refering to the loader being mounted tightly, I was talking about the die in the loader not being tight.


    Jim
     
  5. VThillman

    VThillman Active Member

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    There is no need to lube cases for carbide dies. Re seating depth - does the seating plug match the ogive on your bullets reasonably well? You realize that miking the cartridge length from nose to case end doesn't duplicate what the die is doing, right? I get quite a bit of variation when I'm using lead bullets that aren't real smooth - because both the plug and the caliper get lied to by the unevenness. You can make your readings more consistent by changing to a flat-nose seating plug, but that ain't what your gun is interested in.

    Re carbide wear - If you have run a metal-turning lathe using carbide tools, you know carbide wears; it aint magic. Lee or RCBS dies are good, and not all that expensive; if you're in doubt, go for it.

    And finally, I hope I haven't annoyed you too much!
     
  6. Tommycourt

    Tommycourt Tommycourt

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    VT,
    FIRST of all, you haven't annoyed me at all. If I wasn't catching hell from you and Buster and Jim, I would think you guys were mad at me!! So PLEASE-never feel that way. This is a family forum and all of us here, guys and gals are family.

    My bullet seating plug is semi flat as it was used before for loading SWC and I never even thought of changing it over. Only thing I load are Berry plated RN, 230 gr. and when I seat the bullet, it has a little flat spot on the top of the projectile which doesn't bother me as it won't affect MY accuracy. I try to keep all my rounds @1.250 COAL just for uniformity as I never load hot loads. I don't know, and need to find out if they make a round bullet insert for my RN rounds. I cleaned all my dies again today and will start some depriming tomorrow as the temps aren't supposed to get back up there til the week end. BUT, I will call RCBS about a round nose plug for my die.
    Thanks for the suggestion.
    Tommy:D
     
  7. MagBlackhawk

    MagBlackhawk Patriot

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    Tommy, Here's a thought I wanted to share.
    If there is a slight difference from bullet to bullet in the shape of the bullets nose, that could make the CAOL vary by .005" or more.
    I've found this to be the case with Rainer 380 ACP plated bullets.
    Same thing with Sierra and Hornady 380 JHP bullets. Although not as much.
    But it really shows up with the Win 9mm FMJ bullets I've been using for close range practice.(Got a deal on em for cheep.)
    I measured some Win 9mm FMJ bare bullets. If memory serves correct, some varied by as much as .020" and is probably(?)due to differing nose shapes.
    I set my die for a maximum COAL and some just come out a little shorter. Doesn't hurt accuracy or functioning.
    This may not be what's happening with your bullet seating, but I thought I would throw it out there.
    Take Care and Happy Shooting.
     
  8. phideaux

    phideaux Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter

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    I weigh ALL bullets and sort them into at least 4 groups, according to weight, (+- 1)
    If Im really goona shoot for accuracy with a new gun for testing, I measure every bullet and sort them to groups within the same weight groups according to length.
    Thats about as far as I go to get consistent performance on the bullet side of the eqation.

    It is fun , aint it ?:D



    Jim
     
  9. VThillman

    VThillman Active Member

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    Yep, it's fun. If you like to fiddle around with your loads, there's lots of room for fiddling, and ways to see results. If you stay 'basic' - and stay well away from max loads - that works out OK too, with a little widening of the spread. Without the reloading part of it, I wouldn't shoot much.
     
  10. squirrelhunter

    squirrelhunter Active Member Lifetime Supporter

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    I noticed variation in COAL using some bullets too,some kinds are real close and some aren't. I figure it's variation in the bullet itself and to me it doesn't seem to effect accuracy.
     
  11. Tommycourt

    Tommycourt Tommycourt

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    Mag,
    I have about 1500 9mm rounds loaded now. I used to have Glocks but got rid of them as I didn't like the feel of the 26 and the 19 just didn't shoot like I wanted it to. Both were Gen 3's. The rounds I have loaded are 115 RN Berry's, 4.4 grn. of W231 and a OAL of 1.150. I used the 120gr. alloy round as my spec. I still have my Colt Combat Commander from 1973 which is steel slide with steel frame and fire my 9mm through it. I am happy with the results although I still have the old military sights on it. I sure can't complain about accuracy as it puts the bullets where you aim. Only problem I have with the pistol is the front sight-need to put some green or orange paint on it. However when I load these rounds I use my Dillon Square D loader which is much faster than the Herters. Recoil is really non-existent. With the Dillon I noticed that there is no indentation in the nose as with my Herters. It has to have something to do with the bullet seater. With the Dillon, it also taper crimps the bullets like my Herters does but the shape of the bullet seater must be somewhat different. Maybe I need to tear it apart and take a look. Thanks for the seating info on the .005. That answers a lot of questions for me. Very much appreciated!!!!
    Tommy
     
  12. MagBlackhawk

    MagBlackhawk Patriot

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    Tommy,
    I have just started to work up some practice loads with the Berrys 9mm 115gr plated bullet.
    Was just about to back up to 4.4gr of 231 when I saw this post from you:

    I have about 1500 9mm rounds loaded now. I used to have Glocks but got rid of them as I didn't like the feel of the 26 and the 19 just didn't shoot like I wanted it to. Both were Gen 3's. The rounds I have loaded are 115 RN Berry's, 4.4 grn. of W231 and a OAL of 1.150.

    Thank you, looks like I'm on the right track.