New rifle

Discussion in 'Gunsmithing' started by benhanak, Jul 1, 2016.

  1. benhanak

    benhanak New Member

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    Just ordered a new predator in .308, any tips about barrell break in? Should it be cleaned first before firing? Ive always owned used hand me down rifles and this is my first brand new rifle and id like to have it perform at its best
     
  2. MagBlackhawk

    MagBlackhawk Patriot

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    I'm kinda late to the party here but...
    Yes, It should be cleaned before you fire it.

    Both Savage and Weatherby give barrel break in procedures on their web sites.
    Weatherby has it under the Q & A section. Can't remember where I saw it at Savage. Ruger doesn't say anything about it as far as I know.

    Barrel break in is time consuming but most seem to think it's helpful. I believe everybody agrees it can't hurt.

    I took the time to break in a new Weatherby by following Weatherby's instructions.
    (Shoot one, clean. Do that ten times. Then shoot three, clean. Do that ten times).
    I have not had time to do any target shooting with it but I have noticed the jacket fouling is easier to remove now than it was early on.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2016

  3. benhanak

    benhanak New Member

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    Seems time consuming but very worth it
     
  4. RavenU

    RavenU In the army now..

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    I've been a rifle marksman for most of my life. Until I was in my mid sixties I can honestly say that nobody, anywhere, ever outshot me with a rifle. Shotgun and pistol? Yes, but never with a rifle. I always scrupulously cleaned my new rifles before using them; but I never did any of this currently popular repetitious cleaning, over and over again, before putting one of my new rifles to serious use.

    After a lifetime of very successful rifle marksmanship I see no need, whatsoever, for a new rifle owner to have to go through any of the excessive cleaning so many riflemen seem to be so enamored with, nowadays. All I've ever done is to clean a new rifle BEFORE using it; and ALWAYS after I'm finished using the gun for the day. Works for me! :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2016
  5. VThillman

    VThillman Active Member

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    I know I could read what the Weatherby site has to say, but I am no marksman, nowadays anyway. So... Does the cleaning procedure include the bronze brush? What improved condition does the procedure leave the bore in?
     
  6. spikedriver

    spikedriver Active Member

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    I would clean first. When I've broke in bolt guns I used this method. It takes 15 rounds.

    Shoot once, clean
    Shoot 2x, clean
    Shoot 3x, clean

    Shoot 4x, clean

    You can be using the rounds you've shot until this point to get the gun sighted in. Finish by shooting 5 shots, clean it, then put a fouling shot through it and start shooting groups to find out what the gun likes best.

    Some gun experts say it doesn't need to be that involved. I think David Petzal says just clean it real well every ten shots for the first 50 rounds or so.

    I used the method I described above on a Savage 22-250 and I really noticed that the bore got much "slicker" as I was doing it. Have fun with your Predator and tell us how it turns out!

    P.S. I used Barnes CR10 and Hoppe's #9 back then but the Barnes stuff is wicked so I use Butch's Bore Shine now. It's a little easier on the barrel.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2016
  7. RavenU

    RavenU In the army now..

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    The way I have always cleaned my rifle barrels for, at least, the past 30 years:

    I use a bronze or Tynex brush. I wrap soft cotton patches around the brush head and clean the bore in this way. (I have absolutely no good use for the jag and slotted tips; and, with only a few exceptions, I've thrown them all away!)

    The first series of patches are coated with a cleaner like Break-Free, or Ballistol. The second and final series of patches are coated with Flitz Metal Polish; and I use Flitz to chemically polish my bores. When I'm done cleaning, I'll swab the bore with isopropyl alcohol and, then, wipe it dry before dripping in Sentry Solutions', 'Smooth Kote' PASSIVATED molybdenum disulfide solution.

    Afterwards I'll let the, 'moly' dry for several hours before using the gun; and both accuracy and velocity have always been very good. In a temperature and humidity controlled environment (my gun safe) I've left moly coated barrels sit for up to 4 or 5 years without the slightest problem. (Raw moly is hygroscopic; but Sentry's passivated moly is not.)

    Like I said: Works for me! :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2016
  8. DrDenby

    DrDenby New Member

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    I don't like criticizing people's methods.

    I say what people want to do with their guns is their business and their right.

    I did see something that I felt compelled to comment on though.

    That is the use of metal polish in the barrel.

    I don't care what manufacturers say, ALL polishes are abrasive. Including Flitz which I too use and have used though not IN my barrels.

    There is nothing going on inside a barrel that needs anything but solvent, occasional copper/lead remover, and oil. Well, I should say that there may be rust in a used one you pick up or has been neglected.

    But, I am talking about polish for any kind of routine barrel maintenance/clean.

    Doc

    Oh, and I clean EVERY gun I get first, whether it is new or used. I don't trust ANYone other than me.
     
  9. RavenU

    RavenU In the army now..

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    Not being the, 'new kid on the block' I've been listening to this complaint for, at least, the past two decades - if not more. So, as succinctly stated as I know how, all I'm going to say is, .......

    First, I'm going to agree that there is an extremely mild abrasive quality to Flitz Metal Polish; however, it is nowhere - nowhere - near as, 'intensive' as other bore cleaners like, say, J-B's, 'Non-Embedding Bore Cleaning Compound', or Sweet's, '7.62 Bore Cleaner'; AND - just so we're clear - Flitz Metal Polish is chemically IDENTICAL TO both IOSSO, 'Bore Cleaning & Polishing Compound' and, 'GunBright'; as well as the chemical base that's used in Kleenbore's, 'Lead Away' and Hoppe's, 'Quick Clean' cloths.

    If there is a, 'trick' involved in (all) modern gun cleaning then that, 'trick' is to not abuse your bore by overusing any of these products. I clean a lot of guns; and I've been cleaning a lot of guns for more than 50 years. I think it safe to say that, by now, I have a pretty good idea of what I should or shouldn't be doing!

    When it comes to gun-cleaning, 'donkey work' I don't care to waste my time or, 'elbow grease' with a stinking chemical like Hoppe's #9, or much slower chemical bore cleaners like either Ballistol, or any of the other CLP's. Anyone who is worried about the extremely slight polishing effect Flitz has on metal should simply not overuse it, and NEVER scrub!

    Personally, I usually get all of the difficult-to-remove crud out of a barrel with no more than two or three patches, and no more than 6 to 9 passes. This method works; and it doesn't require, either, a lot of time or effort in order to clean a bore and clean it well.

    No bore cleaning solution is perfect - None! With other slower and more arduous cleaners all of the multiple passes that are always needed in order to clean a barrel can be wearing on the muzzle's crown, as well as on the barrel, itself. Bore wear is attributable to a lot of different factors: friction, residual firing residue, and cleaning are among them. The fact of the matter is that any gun that's used and subsequently maintained often enough IS going to wear out.

    I've got expensive custom-made barrels around here that have been cleaned with Flitz Metal Polish and Break-Free CLP (both the old and new formulas) for more than a quarter century. Know what? These barrels continue to be able to produce better accuracy than the guy who's shooting them; and, by anybody's definition, the guy who shoots them continues to be a highly precise marksman who has a long personal history of NOT tolerating the use of any inaccurate firearm!

    Flitz Metal Polish wearing out gun barrels is a rumor that I've been listening to, and occasionally coming across on internet gun forums for many years, now. IT'S A MYTH! That's all it is. When properly used Flitz Metal Polish is no more wearing on a gun barrel than any other cleaning method that might be employed.

    The chemical gun-cleaning products I won't overuse are compounds like Sweet's, and J-B's. I DO use these products, but only occasionally. (Maybe once or twice a year; and, again, only on certain guns.) Whether it's shooting or cleaning them, I know what I'm doing with guns; and the advice I've posted here is not only, 'tried and true' but reliably sound, and pragmatic.

    So, let's not start another great internet gun forum myth (of which there are already far too many). :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2016
  10. DrDenby

    DrDenby New Member

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    Hey, your gun, you do as you see fit.

    Polish away.

    Obviously your vast experience of a couple decades is good enough for you to declare whats mythical.

    One thing that history has proven time and time and time again, is very very few people ever change their minds. For a very simple reason. Everyone is right. Just ask them.

    To try to change someone's belief is as futile as mixing polka dot paint.

    Too many much more important things in life.

    Like where the hell is all the 357 mag brass !!

    Doc
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2016
  11. benhanak

    benhanak New Member

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    I believe this forum topic was wether or not to break in a new barrell and what method to follow doing so.

    Raven, what cleaner is a good one to use to break in a new barrell and what procedure do you personally follow, if you even do. I would love to hear your infinite wisdom on this question as i have no clue. Also, i think your opinion may bleed into my cleaning habbits of my other firearms. Thank you for your thoughts.
     
  12. benhanak

    benhanak New Member

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    I have a bunch of .357 brass i dont need.....
     
  13. MagBlackhawk

    MagBlackhawk Patriot

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    Weatherby doesn't mention a bronze brush. Just clean thoroughly.
    Savage does tell you to use a brush and how many passes.

    My guess is the break in procedure is done to smooth out the bore by not letting fouling cover any rough spots that may be in a new barrel.
    Could be something to it. My other 25-06 has LOTS of jacket fouling I've NEVER been able to remove. I didn't break in it's barrel when new.
    But hey, I'm only a hobbyist when it comes to firearms..... So there is that.
     
  14. MagBlackhawk

    MagBlackhawk Patriot

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    There is a forum in the Ruger Classifieds called Trades where people are needing .357 brass.
    We all seem to be short on .357 brass around here.

    I would be looking to make a deal but a few others have been asking for it and they probably need it more than I do.
    I'll probably buy some Starline when I run out. Been wanting to try that stuff anyway.
     
  15. phideaux

    phideaux Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter

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    All this break in and cleaning depends on who mfg the barrel , and what it was made for.

    Pro competition target shooting, or everyday plinking or hunting.

    Bartlein, Kreiger , Brux, Shillen...etc.

    Don't need break in. DO NOT BREAK IN.

    Other , Savage, Ruger, Marlin, Winchester, ...its your call, as they are not burnished to the same quality as the afore mentioned. And , yes they probably will have some burrs , however slight that can have an affect on the ballistics.

    Just my $.02



    Jim
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2016
  16. phideaux

    phideaux Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Rudeness and name calling is not tolerated on RugerTalk.




    Jim
     
  17. VThillman

    VThillman Active Member

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    I suspect that this thread is going to stagnate, so before it does...

    I read a post somewhere that espoused the theory that mild copper fouling is beneficial to new rifle bores, specifically because it smooths over those little rough spots. Cleaning should go easy on the copper remover, for that reason.

    Just passing it on, folks. :D
     
  18. DrDenby

    DrDenby New Member

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    The concept that VT is mentioning is correct but needs a little further explanation.

    See, no matter the barrel maker, all barrels will have imperfections. It cannot be helped. It is the nature of the metal.

    Within 2 or 3 shots thru a brand new barrel, there will be miniscule amounts of copper left behind, that will fill in those flaws.

    Over time, that copper fouling WILL build up and it WILL affect accuracy adversely.

    Once you decide it is time to clear the fouling, there is no need to hesitate on being aggressive enough to get it all.

    Within 2 or 3 shots, the miniscule copper residue will smooth over the imperfections again.

    Doc
     
  19. benhanak

    benhanak New Member

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    So, i ran a bore snake through after every shot for 10 rounds today. I wrapped a hoppes field wipe around the brass bristle section and pulled er through. The ammo i used was very clean and there was very little residue left behind on the wipe. I honestly am not sure that accomplished anything but i will say that at 100 yds i had 3 half inch groups. It was a terribly hot day and sweat was a huge problem but had a great time and thats really what matters
     
  20. DrDenby

    DrDenby New Member

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    That's some damn fine shooting with a new gun, Ben. And having fun is the most important thing.

    Yeah sweat is a problem as well as foggy shooting glasses

    For anyone with the foggy glasses problem, I recommend looking into Cat Crap

    $6 for a little flip up container, but works great and only a little dab necessary. Keeps fog free for the at least hour, 2 hours I spend at range.

    Doc