LC9s Jamming at Range

Discussion in 'Range Reports' started by Exit39, Jun 29, 2016.

  1. Exit39

    Exit39 New Member

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    I took my LC9s to the indoor range for the first time and put about 50 rounds through it, also dialing in my laser accuracy. Also brought my Bersa Thunder 380. The first mags on both guns were loaded with Hornady Critical Defense (CD) to get a feel for any kick difference compared to the Remington UMC Centerfire rounds I used for the rest of the firing.

    My Bersa fired beautifully and accurate. The LC9s fired great during my first round using the CD's. However, it jammed twice on two separate occasions using the Rem's.

    The first jam occurred after firing the first round of Rem's in which the slide did not close all the way, leaving about 1/8" to fully closed. A simple tap on the back of it closed it and readied it to fire again.

    The second jam left the slide completely open with the spent shell still in the back of the barrel having not ejected, and the next live round tilted slightly upward in the magazine. With that, I locked the slide open, ejected the magazine having to assist it with my finger from the shell ejector opening due to the next round having been partially sprung forward into the barrel, then tilted the gun backward to remove the spent shell.

    I got home and researched a little online finding this video that describes the exact issue I was having, however not with the CD rounds.

    https://youtu.be/mIZTVfIuGgM

    I physically tested the issue like he does in the video proving that yes, the first couple of rounds hang-up with the feed angle off a bit. It's very disheartening. I read through all the comments and they vary from the magazine design (which I have one of both, the Made in USA and Italy) to the type of rounds, precisely the Hornady CD's. Some recommended to stay away from those on this gun due to tolerance differences. Others recommend the Gold Dots.

    I'd like to hear from anyone who's had this similar issue and if you determined the magazine design was at fault or the particular rounds.
     
  2. spikedriver

    spikedriver Active Member

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    My LC9s loves the CD round. Actually I've never had a malfunction with it. My hammer fired LC9 failed to feed and to fire with certain very light frangible bullets. Also it would drop the Ruger made mag under recoil and then the mag safety would engage. In your case maybe a quick trip to a smith just to check it over might be worthwhile. Critical Defense is one of the very best rounds out there in my opinion and it would be a shame if it wasn't reliable in b your gun. But, there are other good rounds out there too.
     

  3. Gr8_Outdoorsman

    Gr8_Outdoorsman New Member

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    I've never had a single failure of any kind with either my older hammer fired lc9 or my newer lc9s pro after a pile of rounds through each. You may want to send it back to Ruger for them to take a look. They have excellent service from past experiences.
     
  4. Exit39

    Exit39 New Member

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    Interesting. Thanks for the replies so far. I do notice that both the Hornady and Remingtons catch at the top of the magazine when pushed forward just like in the video, only happening with the first two rounds on a full mag. Magazine issue? I may file that area just a bit. I broke down the gun and thoroughly cleaned and lubed it and I'm planning on taking it to the range again this Saturday. I'll alsy try a different brand or two of bullets and report back my experience(s).
     
  5. Exit39

    Exit39 New Member

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    I took my own brief videos of what is happening, I presume. The first video is the LC9s magazine fully stacked with Hornady CD. When I push the bullet, it dips down and the front edge of the shell snags on the lip of the magazine. No, my thumb did not push it down; it travels that way. The second bullet does the same thing, but then the rest seem to straighten. This is why I think the Ruger's magazine may be poorly designed. Does anyone know if their mag may be different? Maybe Ruger had a redesigned one? The video link I provided in my opening thread explains a bit about the 'curvature' the stacked bullets take with the magazine spring when it's loaded.

    In the second video it's Bersa's turn, fully stacked again Hornady CD. Look how cleanly the bullet feeds.

    Ruger LC9s: https://youtu.be/Ba8ax8Qwjfo

    Bersa Thunder 380: https://youtu.be/8Qf65BgIqiQ
     
  6. Exit39

    Exit39 New Member

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    Yesterday I spent some time at the range again. I went alone, so no pics. I brought my brand new Hi-Point 995TS as well. Man, that is a fantastic rifle for the money! And it shares the same 9mm rounds as my LC9s.

    Okay, to the point. I loaded the LC9s with Gold Dot rounds and put 25 rounds through it with no jamming. I also put about 50 rounds of the Remington's through with no jamming. I did not get to shoot the Hornady CD's because I was out and the range didn't have any. But ... I'm excited that the gun performed with no issues. Next time I go I will focus on the Hornady's again to zero in on this. To boost in my favor, I completely tore down the LC9s, thoroughly cleaned and lubed prior to range time. So that could have been a contributing factor as well. I also brought my Allen wrench and dialed in that laser; it's spot on now. :Cooltu:

    Then, I read this, a very interesting read regarding Hornady CD:

    A Word of Caution about Hornady’s Critical Defense Handgun Ammunition
    - by Shawn Dodson

    According to Steve Johnson, Hornady Marketing Communications Manager, the Critical Defense line of handgun ammunition:

    "...is not designed to shoot through glass, is not designed to shoot through a car door, and is not designed to shoot through a wall. If you have to shoot through something like that in a personal defense situation you're probably going to jail."

    -- NRA's American Guardian TV

    Thus if you carry a concealed handgun for personal defense and need to shoot from the inside of your car, through glass or sheetmetal, then you cannot rely on Hornady Critical Defense handgun ammo to perform. If you're stopped at the side of the road changing a flat tire and you're attacked, you cannot rely on Hornady Critical Defense handgun ammo to shoot through glass and sheetmetal, if that's what it takes to stop the attack.

    Laminated automotive windshield glass is an especially difficult barrier for handgun bullets.

    Ironically at least one TV commercial for Hornady Critical Defense handgun ammo depicts a couple stopped on the side of a road, in a remote location, changing out a flat tire. In a scenario such as this you might have to shoot through a raised trunk lid, glass hatchback, raised engine hood, or through the sheetmetal of an open car door.

    If you use Hornady Critical Defense handgun ammo for home defense you cannot rely on it to perform if you have shoot through concealment, such as the corner of a wall or through sheetrock and 2x4 studs near a door jam, to hit the center mass of a violent home intruder who's partially concealed, if that's what it takes to stop the attack.

    Hornady Critical Defense handgun ammo is not designed to shoot through anything other than clothing. It's not tested against anything other than bare gelatin and clothing. Performance against commonly encountered light barrier materials is untested and unknown. Therefore if your self-defense requirements include the capability to shoot through commonly encountered light barrier materials then Hornady Critical Defense handgun ammo is not your best choice.

    The human target presents the same challenges to private citizens as it does to law enforcement. Is a law enforcement officer more likely to have to shoot through glass, sheetmetal or the corner of a wall than a private citzen? Probably. But because the odds are probably greater for law enforcement to encounter these kinds of situations does not mean that the odds are zero for a private citizen.

    Personal defense ammo designed especially for "private citizens" is a niche market. Perhaps it's somehow more morally/socially appealing for a private citizen to use handgun ammunition with less terminal performance capability compared to common law enforcement handgun ammunition?

    If you're looking for specific advice about what handgun ammunition to choose for self-defense then I suggest you consider the loads that have been tested and found to provide outstanding terminal performance which are listed in the thread Service Pistol Duty and Self-Defense Loads posted by Dr. Gary K. Roberts ("DocGKR") at M4Carbine.net Forums.

    Personally, my primary defense handguns are the Glock 19 and Kahr PM-9. I load both with Speer 9mm 124gr +P Gold Dot JHP ammunition, which I purchase for about $27 per 50 round box from Streicher's PoliceHQ.com. Private citizens can purchase Speer Gold Dot and Federal Law Enforcement Tactical HST handgun ammunition directly from Streicher's.

    FirearmsTactical.com: TacticalBriefs, April 2006


    Based on my 'short' experience thus far, I am changing my carry loads to the Gold Dots. It is available as a heavier grain bullet like what I used, compared to the lighter Hornady. But like I said, I'm still going to test the Hornady's a bit just for the sake of the issues I experienced.


    Not Ruger, but hey it's a new toy and I'm the proud papa. Looking to add a dual mag clip on the stock and tactical light: :rolleyes:

    [​IMG]
     
  7. VThillman

    VThillman Active Member

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    You seem not to have considered the potential for personal disaster that exists when your round is intentionally capable of collateral damage.
     
  8. Exit39

    Exit39 New Member

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    Please explain further. I like to hear all sides. :)
     
  9. nickndfl

    nickndfl Active Member

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    I was looking at a pistol caliber carbine Hi-point or the Kel-Tec sub2000 folder, but settled on a used Mech Tech upper for a Glock 19.
     
  10. VThillman

    VThillman Active Member

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    Hornady sells a 'windshield-penetrating' round, called 'Critical Duty". It is intended to appeal to LE. The Critical Defense round is designed to be deterred by the materials mentioned in the article you reference. Far as I know, there is no way to design a bullet that will not go through an apartment wall, but will reliably go through a car door.
     
  11. Exit39

    Exit39 New Member

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    I see from this that I should spell out my use of "CD." I was not aware of the Critical Duty line, only the Critical Defense. Thank you. Thankfully, I don't live in an apartment and HOPEFULLY I will never have to fire at a human target. I appreciate your insight here. :Cooltu:
     
  12. Exit39

    Exit39 New Member

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    I held and really liked the Kel-Tec Sub2000. Funny too, I'm not a fan of their pistols. I do like that they are somewhat local to me for warranty purposes and hear they are very good about it. They are in Daytona; I'm about 200 miles south. But money was an issue and for half the cost I ended up with the Hi-Point.